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"Maxi Micra" project....by EBBdude.
- Thread starter EBBdude
- Start date
- Status
superls
K10 Tuner
good work, definitely looking forward to the power figures on that inlet
will you be testing the mods step by step?
this point
"Pistons =
-DIY make a high compr version out of the stock 1,3 pistons"
can be easily done with some run of the mill OEM cg10 pistons, there the same external dimensions but aren't dished on the crown like the cg13 ones
will you be testing the mods step by step?
this point
"Pistons =
-DIY make a high compr version out of the stock 1,3 pistons"
can be easily done with some run of the mill OEM cg10 pistons, there the same external dimensions but aren't dished on the crown like the cg13 ones
Hmm would that work superls? Wouldnt the dish (CG13) allow the tiniest bit of extra 'ingredients' for the compression? or are you planning that the taken space (undished CG10 pistons) make for a stronger crush and compression off the same 'ingredients'?
Love learning new things, especially from this thread
.
Does any of what i said make sense? haha.
Love learning new things, especially from this thread
.Does any of what i said make sense? haha.
Oki , on my list of modifications to do the one in RED is done :
Inlet manifold = make more efficient / increase capacity
Pistons = make a high compr version out of the stock 1,3 pistons
Cylinderhead = increase capacity , increase compression
Valve lifters = modify to lighter and “shimless”
Valvesprings = harder
Valves = marginally larger
Camshafts = DIY regrind for more lift
Exhaust manifold = modify for more capacity,,work with the old one.
Ok , i will now after having done the inlet go ahead and modify the 1,3 liters engines pistons .
As said earlier I will NOT buy new parts doing this neither swop from the 1.0 l engine.
I will simply just do my ownes and raise the compression ratio that way.
Here are the 4 little pistons that I am going to work on
You can see how they have a so called ; negative dome on top of the crown of the piston.
This gives the 1,3 engine its 9,5:1 compr. Ratio.
I want higher and that’s what ill get after my work !
Here you can see the negative dome a bit better
Giving them a good wash in the parts washer before starting working.
First thing I have to do is to separate the pistons and their con-rod bolt from the conrod itself.
I have seen so many weird and strange looking ways on the net of doing this so I thought I show you my way of doing it easy and without destroying the piston or anything else in the process.
The piston pins are a press-fit assembly meaning that the piston pin sits into the small end of the conrod with a predetermined pressed fit of a few houndreds of a millimiter.
I will just make a simple jig for the piston to lay in and press the pin out through the jig.
Starting off with a aluminum tubing found in a dumpster nearby
Cranking up my lathe and cut the tube to my desired length
Turning the inside diameter to match , almost , perfect the outer dia of the piston
Here you can see the two part fitting nicely together
The assembly will go into the hydraulic press and there I just use a old piston pin from another cars piston to press gently out the Micras pins
Closeup of the jig assembly
If I do it right I end up with this , no parts damaged
Then comes the fun part , transforming these 9,5 : 1 pistons to hysteric screaming 12:1 + beasts
But first I will weigh my pistons on a scale so that I know what wight I need to get the complete piston assembly down to afterward when I am finished weight
Update on the piston fun in a bit
Inlet manifold = make more efficient / increase capacity
Pistons = make a high compr version out of the stock 1,3 pistons
Cylinderhead = increase capacity , increase compression
Valve lifters = modify to lighter and “shimless”
Valvesprings = harder
Valves = marginally larger
Camshafts = DIY regrind for more lift
Exhaust manifold = modify for more capacity,,work with the old one.
Ok , i will now after having done the inlet go ahead and modify the 1,3 liters engines pistons .
As said earlier I will NOT buy new parts doing this neither swop from the 1.0 l engine.
I will simply just do my ownes and raise the compression ratio that way.
Here are the 4 little pistons that I am going to work on
You can see how they have a so called ; negative dome on top of the crown of the piston.
This gives the 1,3 engine its 9,5:1 compr. Ratio.
I want higher and that’s what ill get after my work !
Here you can see the negative dome a bit better
Giving them a good wash in the parts washer before starting working.
First thing I have to do is to separate the pistons and their con-rod bolt from the conrod itself.
I have seen so many weird and strange looking ways on the net of doing this so I thought I show you my way of doing it easy and without destroying the piston or anything else in the process.
The piston pins are a press-fit assembly meaning that the piston pin sits into the small end of the conrod with a predetermined pressed fit of a few houndreds of a millimiter.
I will just make a simple jig for the piston to lay in and press the pin out through the jig.
Starting off with a aluminum tubing found in a dumpster nearby
Cranking up my lathe and cut the tube to my desired length
Turning the inside diameter to match , almost , perfect the outer dia of the piston
Here you can see the two part fitting nicely together
The assembly will go into the hydraulic press and there I just use a old piston pin from another cars piston to press gently out the Micras pins
Closeup of the jig assembly
If I do it right I end up with this , no parts damaged
Then comes the fun part , transforming these 9,5 : 1 pistons to hysteric screaming 12:1 + beasts
But first I will weigh my pistons on a scale so that I know what wight I need to get the complete piston assembly down to afterward when I am finished weight
Update on the piston fun in a bit
frank
Club Member
Your more nuts thank Frank!!
who me ? :wasntme:
mine was a weldfilled head tho eh (looks like EEB is going for a weldfilled piston dish)
and i toyed with making a jig like that
but it would,nt have worked on my coilpack (slipper type, without the full skirt) 1.0 and 1.4 pistons (left and right in pic)
Attachments
x2 (Y)It would be nice to see a dyno run with the modified inlet manifold as a separate modification. I'm sure everyone here would like to see that EBB
i will not test this inlet as a separate thing on this project.
As mentioned i will mess around with the in-manifold , pistons , camshafts and the cylinderhead , the OEM modified ex-manifold and in the end a diy built 4-2-1 ex-manifold .
But there might be another micra fan who will test one of these modified inlets on a std engine,,,,time will tell
Will update with the rest of the piston build soon....
As mentioned i will mess around with the in-manifold , pistons , camshafts and the cylinderhead , the OEM modified ex-manifold and in the end a diy built 4-2-1 ex-manifold .
But there might be another micra fan who will test one of these modified inlets on a std engine,,,,time will tell
Will update with the rest of the piston build soon....
thats shame really, dont get why not
frank
Club Member
yeh, come-on guys, get your fingers out, and do some of your own testing, and stop complaining
yeh, come-on guys, get your fingers out, and do some of your own testing, and stop complaining
Buy me a dyno
:laugh:Well guys , here is the rest of the piston modification :
Now for the welding itself.
Have to preheat , weld , more preheat and building material in a controlled manner.
Here a have started the first “ run “ of the welding process
After some work it is easy to see whats going on
Then it is just a matter of doing it right , building up the negative dome to a flat aerea.
After all welding is done and the controlled cool down period is finished the pistons will go into the milling machineadjsut the height of the now flat piston top.
Turning the piston the other way and removing material to get target weight
The pins will then be weighed
And turned lighter in the lathe
All the work is done on the pistons and pin and all that is left is to install the pin/ pistons to the conrods.
That is done by heating the conrods small end like this
I have this small jig thingy that you can see amongst the now finished pistons that now have a flat top
The RED line is now showing that flat top instead of what i started with ; a negative dome.
Less volume in the piston ( zero actually ) and that equals a total higher static compression figure.
And that was the goal for this DIY modification of the pistons.
Well , thats the pistons and what do you think about that my fellow Micra fans ?
Next coming up is even more DIY modification to some other components….
Now for the welding itself.
Have to preheat , weld , more preheat and building material in a controlled manner.
Here a have started the first “ run “ of the welding process
After some work it is easy to see whats going on
Then it is just a matter of doing it right , building up the negative dome to a flat aerea.
After all welding is done and the controlled cool down period is finished the pistons will go into the milling machineadjsut the height of the now flat piston top.
Turning the piston the other way and removing material to get target weight
The pins will then be weighed
And turned lighter in the lathe
All the work is done on the pistons and pin and all that is left is to install the pin/ pistons to the conrods.
That is done by heating the conrods small end like this
I have this small jig thingy that you can see amongst the now finished pistons that now have a flat top
The RED line is now showing that flat top instead of what i started with ; a negative dome.
Less volume in the piston ( zero actually ) and that equals a total higher static compression figure.
And that was the goal for this DIY modification of the pistons.
Well , thats the pistons and what do you think about that my fellow Micra fans ?
Next coming up is even more DIY modification to some other components….
Wow, never seen anyone fill up a cast piston with weld before on the piston crowns. Out of interest, did you carry out any PWHT on the pistons after welding EBB, or just let them air cool?
Also how did the before an after dimensional measurements come out on the finished pistons?
Also how did the before an after dimensional measurements come out on the finished pistons?
Thak you all again for comments:grinning:
@superls
The filler is a ALu-tig rod for such work with added ,,,hm,,,silicium i think it is.
Have used this kind of rods for many years now for such work and they always work well..
The pins & piston assembly each, weighs in at 4 grams LESS than they did before i modified them. that means that 1 piston w / pin = 4 gr LESS than stock.
@Alexzaki
the results will be in at the end when all of the mentioned stuff has been done
@Frank
just my way of playing the game
@Noddie
As i said to Alexzaki , it will be in later in the process
@superls
The filler is a ALu-tig rod for such work with added ,,,hm,,,silicium i think it is.
Have used this kind of rods for many years now for such work and they always work well..
The pins & piston assembly each, weighs in at 4 grams LESS than they did before i modified them. that means that 1 piston w / pin = 4 gr LESS than stock.
@Alexzaki
the results will be in at the end when all of the mentioned stuff has been done
@Frank
just my way of playing the game
@Noddie
As i said to Alexzaki , it will be in later in the process
I dont think the piston itself is cast iron, only the conrod etc.
frank
Club Member
they,re cast ally i think SJ (with forged crank and rods, like the GA,s)
@Low rider
That depends on the mood im in
just kidding,,,it depends on the material that the piston is made of and the " consitstency" of the material.
i have two way of doing that :
-digitally controlled owen and run cycle
-Throw them into a case of australian quarts " sand " and wait till they are ready to go.
The physical dimensions will come out as a consequence of your practical skill level of doing it. Do it right and it is just minor work needed , do it wrong and you have to look for a new set of pistons
I have been doing this kind of modification for many years now and never had a single piston fail as a consequence of welding them....
Just to show another example , this little longtime project of mine :
( the little red & white in front )
Has run welded pistons now for,,,hm,,,let see,,,,,4 or 5th seson now so it works ok for most engines,,,,done right that is
That depends on the mood im in
just kidding,,,it depends on the material that the piston is made of and the " consitstency" of the material.
i have two way of doing that :
-digitally controlled owen and run cycle
-Throw them into a case of australian quarts " sand " and wait till they are ready to go.
The physical dimensions will come out as a consequence of your practical skill level of doing it. Do it right and it is just minor work needed , do it wrong and you have to look for a new set of pistons
I have been doing this kind of modification for many years now and never had a single piston fail as a consequence of welding them....
Just to show another example , this little longtime project of mine :
( the little red & white in front )
Has run welded pistons now for,,,hm,,,let see,,,,,4 or 5th seson now so it works ok for most engines,,,,done right that is
and do you think they'll be fine with the nos?
On my list over DIY modifications i have done, with this level in the Maxi Micra set up, the inlet manifold and high-compression pistons can be checked out.
Inlet manifold =
more capacityFINISHED DIY
Pistons =
Higher compression / lighter. FINISHEDDIY
Camshafts = DIY
More lift.
Cylinderhead = DIY
-more capacity
-valvelifte modification , shimless
-valvespring , harder
-valves , bigger
Ex-manifold
-more capacity
So next thing on my list is DIY camshaft modification.
The original camshafts in such a 1,3 engine works great for everyday driving but they are a bit lazy when you want to stretch the legs even further , specially if you want even more punch in the upper range of the rpm aerea like I want to.
Here is a OEM 1,3 camshaft and its profile
This engine is not a low rpm grinder and with its small volume I have to take advantage of more rpms to get things going.
What i want is more lift out to the valves for better breathing in conjunction with a upcoming DIY cylinderhead that the MAxi is going to abuse.
Sacrifize some low end grunt is no problemos for me as long as i get a payback at the top end.
When I started this journey with the Maxi Micra it had its Hp peak at 5400 rpm and its torque peak at 2900 rpm.
Much to wimpy for me !
So i will make this machine reaching its potentional power at the 7000 + rpm aerea for the power and hopefully get away with a 3500-3600 rpm torque peak.
Gear changes at 7700-8200rpm range so I need power all the way up to 7000 rpm+
How will i go about doing this then ?
As everything else in this project , full DIY attack and make them myself (Y)
A camshaft has a given lift and so called duration that defines the wildness of a engine.
The 1,3 cams are not to bad but they need more lift and of course more duration would have been nice to. Maybe also a little alteration of when the cams starts to open in relative to eachother and so on. Well ,not all is possible but I will get more lift that’s for sure.
Here we can se one of the lift-ramps of a OEM 1,3 camshaft.
It gives the engine flexibility to take granny to the shop and commute to work,,nice and well.
The Maxi Micra is going to do all that as well as screaming down the tracks like a wild devil from h….
Buying new cams via ” card-code-enter ” is not a option for me so that leaves me with doing it my way !
Lets have a look at the OEM camshafts lift
Here we can se the 0-lift aerea on the bottom of the cam-lobe where the measuring gauge is zeroed.
Look at the next picture and we now see how much lift it has as we turn the camshafts to it full lift position
Pretty exactly 7,9 mm that leads out to these little fellows
Then , as you can see , there is a large aerea that doesn’t give any lift , called the base-radius ( o lift ) and we have a lift ramp that leads us all the way to max lift , as here 7,9 mm.
The valves are open all around from the base-radius stops , lift ramp begins and back to lift ramp end.
All I want to do first is to get more lift ,at as long as possible at the lift ramp and I have calculated a bit and 1,6 mm more lift will serve me just fine to get some more push in the system.
Ok , lets have a look at how this crazy Micra fan will do that.
First to do is to arrange some simple markings at the cam-lobes
Brush on some machinist-blue stuff and then it is a piece of cake to mark them as needed.
These markings are sat on specific points at the lobes , on the exact same location with a degree wheel so that I will get correct reference points for my future work on the cams.
If you want to find out how this end,,,then pop in a little bit later….
Inlet manifold =
more capacityFINISHED DIY
Pistons =
Higher compression / lighter. FINISHEDDIY
Camshafts = DIY
More lift.
Cylinderhead = DIY
-more capacity
-valvelifte modification , shimless
-valvespring , harder
-valves , bigger
Ex-manifold
-more capacity
So next thing on my list is DIY camshaft modification.
The original camshafts in such a 1,3 engine works great for everyday driving but they are a bit lazy when you want to stretch the legs even further , specially if you want even more punch in the upper range of the rpm aerea like I want to.
Here is a OEM 1,3 camshaft and its profile
This engine is not a low rpm grinder and with its small volume I have to take advantage of more rpms to get things going.
What i want is more lift out to the valves for better breathing in conjunction with a upcoming DIY cylinderhead that the MAxi is going to abuse.
Sacrifize some low end grunt is no problemos for me as long as i get a payback at the top end.
When I started this journey with the Maxi Micra it had its Hp peak at 5400 rpm and its torque peak at 2900 rpm.
Much to wimpy for me !
So i will make this machine reaching its potentional power at the 7000 + rpm aerea for the power and hopefully get away with a 3500-3600 rpm torque peak.
Gear changes at 7700-8200rpm range so I need power all the way up to 7000 rpm+
How will i go about doing this then ?
As everything else in this project , full DIY attack and make them myself (Y)
A camshaft has a given lift and so called duration that defines the wildness of a engine.
The 1,3 cams are not to bad but they need more lift and of course more duration would have been nice to. Maybe also a little alteration of when the cams starts to open in relative to eachother and so on. Well ,not all is possible but I will get more lift that’s for sure.
Here we can se one of the lift-ramps of a OEM 1,3 camshaft.
It gives the engine flexibility to take granny to the shop and commute to work,,nice and well.
The Maxi Micra is going to do all that as well as screaming down the tracks like a wild devil from h….
Buying new cams via ” card-code-enter ” is not a option for me so that leaves me with doing it my way !
Lets have a look at the OEM camshafts lift
Here we can se the 0-lift aerea on the bottom of the cam-lobe where the measuring gauge is zeroed.
Look at the next picture and we now see how much lift it has as we turn the camshafts to it full lift position
Pretty exactly 7,9 mm that leads out to these little fellows
Then , as you can see , there is a large aerea that doesn’t give any lift , called the base-radius ( o lift ) and we have a lift ramp that leads us all the way to max lift , as here 7,9 mm.
The valves are open all around from the base-radius stops , lift ramp begins and back to lift ramp end.
All I want to do first is to get more lift ,at as long as possible at the lift ramp and I have calculated a bit and 1,6 mm more lift will serve me just fine to get some more push in the system.
Ok , lets have a look at how this crazy Micra fan will do that.
First to do is to arrange some simple markings at the cam-lobes
Brush on some machinist-blue stuff and then it is a piece of cake to mark them as needed.
These markings are sat on specific points at the lobes , on the exact same location with a degree wheel so that I will get correct reference points for my future work on the cams.
If you want to find out how this end,,,then pop in a little bit later….
@will930
As so happen to be i have a full balancing machine park and can tell for sure that your comment,,,,,smells like a sack of """"
There is no need whatsoever for a rebalance of the rotating parts in the engine if the pistons are 4 gr lighter....:laugh:
Yes , better belive it , this has not even begun,,,,the madness is just warming upgrr
As so happen to be i have a full balancing machine park and can tell for sure that your comment,,,,,smells like a sack of """"
There is no need whatsoever for a rebalance of the rotating parts in the engine if the pistons are 4 gr lighter....:laugh:
Yes , better belive it , this has not even begun,,,,the madness is just warming upgrr
i thought he has a valid point ebbdude?
or the way your gonna do it (cams)minimises its being unbalanced
may the force be with me as i aint clued that much at all:laugh:
:laugh::laugh: we all wish
Kicking off some more work with the camshafts and i will show you my superduper high-tech tools that i will do the work with :
First tool is this one :
A regular metal lathe
Supertool number 2 is this one
A regular bench grinder with one coarse and one fine grit stone
And last but not least,,,,4 pieces of rubber bands
Yes , some heavy duty high tech tools….ha.ha
Oki , lets start doing some work then:
The lathe is the base set up / jig for the work , it holds the camshafts so that they can be rotated to the pre-determined angles that I will grind the cams at.
I will grind the cams base-circle and partly the lift ramps themselves.
Here I have put everything in place to commence grinding
Doing some grinding here
As i go along i check my progress , here the base-circle and how it is parallel after gringind.
Within a houndreth of a millimeter if not to shabby, quite ok for an amateur.
Using the lathes functions to control the depth of the grinding and I can just feed the cross-feed to get the desired reduction of the base in a precise way.
When it comes to the transfer from base-circle to the lift ramp I use a simple trick with some rubber bands and in that manner I can even profile-grind with high precision.
( im sorry but I will not reveal that particular method )
Here is the finished result and you can see that I have , as a result of the grinding process, now 9,5 mm lift at the cam-lobe instead of the 7.9 I started with.
A net result of 1,6 mm more lift.
I have lost a tiny bit of mid-lift duration on the lobes but that I can easily live with doing it the true DIY way.
The lobes are now also grinded a bit ” offset ” to get even more punch in the high rpm aerea , excactly what im looking for.
Her is a compare of a OEM 1,3 cam ( left ) and a full DIY home grind edition
The 2 finished cams that will go into the next level of the Maxi Micra engine.
Well , my adventure with the cams is then finished in genuine DIY spirit !
So wadda you think about that guys ?
I am now ready to explore some more engine stuff……
Cul8r
First tool is this one :
A regular metal lathe
Supertool number 2 is this one
A regular bench grinder with one coarse and one fine grit stone
And last but not least,,,,4 pieces of rubber bands
Yes , some heavy duty high tech tools….ha.ha
Oki , lets start doing some work then:
The lathe is the base set up / jig for the work , it holds the camshafts so that they can be rotated to the pre-determined angles that I will grind the cams at.
I will grind the cams base-circle and partly the lift ramps themselves.
Here I have put everything in place to commence grinding
Doing some grinding here
As i go along i check my progress , here the base-circle and how it is parallel after gringind.
Within a houndreth of a millimeter if not to shabby, quite ok for an amateur.
Using the lathes functions to control the depth of the grinding and I can just feed the cross-feed to get the desired reduction of the base in a precise way.
When it comes to the transfer from base-circle to the lift ramp I use a simple trick with some rubber bands and in that manner I can even profile-grind with high precision.
( im sorry but I will not reveal that particular method )
Here is the finished result and you can see that I have , as a result of the grinding process, now 9,5 mm lift at the cam-lobe instead of the 7.9 I started with.
A net result of 1,6 mm more lift.
I have lost a tiny bit of mid-lift duration on the lobes but that I can easily live with doing it the true DIY way.
The lobes are now also grinded a bit ” offset ” to get even more punch in the high rpm aerea , excactly what im looking for.
Her is a compare of a OEM 1,3 cam ( left ) and a full DIY home grind edition
The 2 finished cams that will go into the next level of the Maxi Micra engine.
Well , my adventure with the cams is then finished in genuine DIY spirit !
So wadda you think about that guys ?
I am now ready to explore some more engine stuff……
Cul8r
@Frank
i think you will be suprised later on to see the results of the torque curve
@Noddie
i think you will be even more surprised to see that i did not increase any shims or something like that:glare:
It will all be revealed a bit later on.....
@Low rider
Some things you just wanna have under the pillow
i think you will be suprised later on to see the results of the torque curve
@Noddie
i think you will be even more surprised to see that i did not increase any shims or something like that:glare:
It will all be revealed a bit later on.....
@Low rider
Some things you just wanna have under the pillow
frank
Club Member
frank
Club Member
@Frank
Nope
Not cunning and absolute not any top-hat buttons....
Think oem Frank
hmm, weld extended valvestems and bucket tops ground flat ? :grinning:
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