• Please only use these forums for blogs, they are not a discussion forum

PollyMobiles Rebuild

OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
bah
just rang ProX and they don't have them rings.
called Co Ord in uk and they don't recognise the part num
gonna call JE again to order em direct and risk the custom tax

damn my work phone can't call international,
my PAYG phones only got 1.52
its 8p/min calling usa
tday I can only topup by £10

i think i'll wait till i'm home tonight :/
 

Low Rider

Poindexter
Founding Member
Moderator
Club Member
bah
just rang ProX and they don't have them rings.
called Co Ord in uk and they don't recognise the part num
gonna call JE again to order em direct and risk the custom tax

damn my work phone can't call international,
my PAYG phones only got 1.52
its 8p/min calling usa
tday I can only topup by £10

i think i'll wait till i'm home tonight :/
Co-Ord? hahahaha, that doesn't surprise me........they're as good as a one-legged man in an a** kicking contest. I remember trying to order a flywheel through them and no matter what I said the guy just kept repeating '£299+VAT' at me. No surprise I ended up dealing direct with the manufacturer and bypassing their so called 'approved retailer' completely
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
I rang sabastian at JE bout the rings.
they have various suppliers for rings but i think Wiseco is one of em. the product code should be standard for any JE distributor so i just ring anyone who sells JE pistons and they should have it on their system.

anyway he'll need to get a quote from UPS for delivery who does next day or express deliveries but its estimated at least $100! plus $66 for the rings and 20% customs tax, hence why he suggested i try find a european distributor.

while he's getting quotes, he searched and found some other potential UK suppliers to try tomorrow:
Performance Unlimited
Burton Power
Blakeney Motorsport

if no one here has the XC7150 I'm gonna have to suck it up and fork out a fortune for these rings o_O
 

Low Rider

Poindexter
Founding Member
Moderator
Club Member
Performance unlimited are good, most people get their custom rod/piston combos through them, except me of course, (trust me to be different) :rolleyes:

I suspect that they are likely to be an uncommon stock but hopefully you'll be lucky or it's wallet punching time by the sounds of it :eek:
 

camoxodka

car half done :)
emailed ProX in netherlands but no reply yet. I'm gonna ring em tday to find out if they have the rings.

it'll all be ready for JAE one way or another

ya see the spannerheads have dropped the Vibe down to £375 lol
yea i have seen it, i wont be suprise it will cost around 299 by the end of this week :) he is the worst seller
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
ok update, and what a ballache to find these rings.

no one in EU has em in stock.
TTS performance can order em in for £24.75 each + vat + £7 post = £126!
Performance Unlimited can order em for £17.66 each + vat + £7.50 post = £93 :)
PartBox is getting quote from wiseco europe and ring back tomorrow.
manager from Blakeney Motorsports out so will call him at 2pm.

looks like perf unlimited is the likely source
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
just got a txt from peter at Co-Ord saying the rings I'm looking for are 2815XC £23 each + vat

suppose the code means 2.815" = 71.5mm bore
but dunno if the other dimensions, type of rings and material is suitable for the JE pistons. will need to check with JE
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
gonna leave the 2815xc, tis causing more headache & confusion since i've found that performance unlimited can order the correct ringset that JE specified in the first place for low cost so I'll order that tomorrow.
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
since its quiet, thought i'd overhaul the head. that soft graphite exhasut gasket was baked onto the head and peeled apart so it needs another gasket:rolleyes:

DSC06601.JPG


burning all that oil has clogged the exhaust ports with a mm of gooey soot. it's gonna takes days to scrape it all clearo_O

DSC06602.JPG
DSC06603.JPG
DSC06604.JPG
DSC06605.JPG
 
Last edited:
probably more hassle than help but what about stripping the head down and using kerro or a parts washer shouldn't be to much work to get that crud off then o_O
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
coulda washed it in my big washing tub but its with the machinist when i was carrying the block in.
abit of wirebrushing and elbow grease will do for now
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
ok ordered a set of XC7150 from performance unlimited for £93

rang machinist and everything seems fine, and bore is round and no scoring except the piston-bore clearance is abit tight at just over 2.5thou, surprised it hasn't been rubbing. the light scoring of the piston sides are prob some debris which could've also caused the pitted main bearing.
he suggests he could lightly hone it to over 3thou, slightly too loose is better than too tight

the main bearing is kinda ok and crank journal has very light scratch, depends on how much i wanna spend as he suggests if i was to replace all the main bearings, i may as well regrind the crank so its all perfect. gonna ring me back with quote how much extra it could be.

he's on holiday for 2weeks tomorrow but can finish it tday.

and then i just check the rings in the bore myself when i get it next week.
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
whoa i just seen on ebay 4 sets of r888 195/50/15 with 4mm tread for £250 collect in person (£63 each) :eek:
but its like on the other end of the UK which is 12hrs of driving using £90 of fuel.
dunno if i should go with these or buy 2 new 595rsr
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
figured I'd go ahead with replacing all the main shells and may require crank regrind but its another £100 :eek:
meh, for abit of fortune may as well go all the way
 

Antony

Ex. Club Member
when i replaced the bearings in the engine i sold K6PFS, i ordered the correct bearings (as numbered on the block and crank) and measured the journals with a digital micrometer, they were within 0.01mm of stock, and the engine i had had done over 120,000 miles (bought from nex)....
i highly doubt that the crank will need a re-grind what with the massive selection of bearing shells available...
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
I'll let the guy judge if the crank is ok with the new shells.

i figured to clean the ports i could just scrape the gunk off with a blade and finish dusting the soot off with the wirebrush drill

DSC06606.JPG


cleaned

DSC06607.JPG
DSC06608.JPG


valves scraped clean on drill/lathe and fitted

DSC06609.JPG
DSC06610.JPG


head assembled. just needs retapping and old gasket scraped off

DSC06611.JPG
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
was just browsing autotrader for k11s as usual and found this 1998 1.3 slx for £800 almost exact same spec as my blue SLX except alloys and omg how friggin mint it looks all over:cool: tis like its been stored in showroom like forever

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classif...ords/1.3_slx/page/1/postcode/ts13ba?logcode=p



if I'd known bout this one back before i brought and restored this grey slx chassis, I'd buy it asap for such mint condition
wonder what the chassis's like
 
ABS don't need that just lock up the wheels going round a corner and realise there is a learner in the middle of the road and end up a little bit of the hedge
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
learning to pulse brake at the limit is our natural ABS:D
i tend to find it engages way too soon and affects braking performance especially on circuits hence turn mine off now
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
head cleaned n threads retapped.

assessed the oil pump and is within tolerance

DSC06613.JPG
DSC06614.JPG
DSC06612.JPG


while waiting for block and crank to be ready on monday, the only thing left to do is to figure out how to improve the oil pan baffle plate design
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
they,re only 1mm thick eh paul, cant you bolt a plate ontop of the stock baffle ?
suppose i could pop rivet a plate over the existing baffle but prefer a clean fresh fit

the spare stored engine (original overbored forged engine block) has the old rusty sump that was from the turbo kit. since its never used i could experiment welding on that:)
now where to find some local mild sheet steel?
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
tdays such a luvely day:cool:
went to dealers and ordered a HG, coolant return pipe o-ring and timing cover oil seal. the warehouse doesn't have any and its on backorder so I'll have to prob wait a week or two. then got some oil filters & sparks from motorfactors.

checked out b&q for any sheet steel and they sold a 500x250x1 sheet steel for a tenner, yea expensive but meh it'll do. dunno if its mild but guy says when he used it it'll rust so could be, tis in a sealed oiled wallet
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
was thinking about brake cooling, could i get a duct towards the hub?
but i noticed that the front half of the hub center is blocked by the caliper carrier frame so the disc can only extract limited cool air from the back half of the hub

DSC06615.JPG


and half of the potential gap is blocked by this silly shroud. so no wonder it wasn't getting enough cool air and as seen in the front susp cam from the last trackday, the disc just got hotter and hotter till it was glowing red and churned its way through the pads

DSC06616.JPG
DSC06617.JPG


its just press fitted on the hub body so i dremeled a slot and levered off, but the shroud was already breaking away with rust so i didn't have to cut it:rolleyes:

DSC06618.JPG
DSC06619.JPG


grinded flat the dremel marks so there's no stress points

DSC06620.JPG
DSC06621.JPG


on the other shroud i just chiseled it off with ease

DSC06622.JPG
DSC06623.JPG


wow so much more gap. this will def help cooling

DSC06624.JPG
DSC06625.JPG

DSC06626.JPG
DSC06627.JPG
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
the oil baffle plate is 125mm from the top of the sump and holds 2ltrs

DSC06628.JPG


with 3L the level is 100mm from the top

DSC06629.JPG


and with 3.5L which i think is the dipstick max level its 90mm from the sump top and just level with the turbo drain plug

DSC06630.JPG
DSC06631.JPG


with the sump full of water i tested how the baffle controls the fluid. appears it doesn't do too well. oil just gushes easily past the 2 gaping holes so no surprise that the brief whiney PAS pump type noise i hear on trackdays when i turn hard right might well be the starved oil pump


to remove the baffle I tried grinding away the spot welds and chisel the flanges off but its just too noisy and dusty with little result

DSC06632.JPG


so instead i drill through the spot welds easy enough. will be plug welding the new baffle on anyway

DSC06633.JPG


the drain plug sticks up a fair bit, so a little amount of oily crap would actually be left at the very bottom near the oil pickup?
maybe I should weld a nut & bolt under the bottom of the sump to fully empty it? or would it stick out too much? i think the nut should be mig or tigged on by my local welder so it doesn't leak and is strong enough if it does get knocked

DSC06634.JPG


this is where the pickup goes, look at the massive gaps

DSC06635.JPG
DSC06636.JPG
DSC06637.JPG


I'll need to hoist up the spare engine and measure the position of the crankcase so i know how much space there is.

not sure at the moment how to layout the new baffle plate like:

oil pickup hole:
too large = oil could slosh out the hole,
too small = not enough oil allowed to flow down into the baffled cavity so it all pools up above the baffle plate, churning against the spinning crank and starving the pickup.

baffle plate edges:
sealed all round - thoroughly keeps the existing oil thats inside from sloshing out but may prevent returning oil from filling the baffled cavity up if the pickup hole is too small = churning oil & starved oil pickup.
small gaps all round - allows some oil to return into the cavity but allows the baffled oil to gradually leak out when turning a long fast right, still better than a stock baffle.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
measured underneath the engine to get these dimensions

lower engine measurement.jpg


made a template from cardboard

DSC06638.JPG


with the measurements i initially cut a 60mm hole but seemed too tight for oil to return through and tricky guiding the pickup through during removal so enlarged it to 70mm

DSC06640.JPG


how the pickup relates to the baffle

DSC06641.JPG
DSC06642.JPG


in the sump

DSC06643.JPG
DSC06644.JPG
DSC06645.JPG


where the baffle is relative to the pickup and crankcase

DSC06646.JPG
DSC06647.JPG


test fitted the sump onto the block and looking through the turbo drain it seems ok

DSC06648.JPG


pickup support bracket touching the plate so needs trimming

DSC06649.JPG


refined template

DSC06651.JPG


new baffle vs stock, much less leaking gaps

DSC06652.JPG
 
Last edited:

frank

Club Member
we used to have the same problem with ministox on a clockwise oval, and had to fit a central pickup pipe.
the oil light would light up on hard cornering, has yours paul ?
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
Looks like you're onto something there eh Paul :)
just need guidance on if i need to leave any gaps on the edges and how the oil would return back down. just concerned that if the return oil doesn't go down the middle hole during light turning, it could starve the pickup when i turn a long hard corner?

thinking of adding some additional vertical baffles too to further control the sloshing momentum
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
we used to have the same problem with ministox on a clockwise oval, and had to fit a central pickup pipe.
the oil light would light up on hard cornering, has yours paul ?
i read that whenever the oil pressure has dropped so much that the oil light comes on, even for a brief sec at high rev, its pretty much game over for the bearings under such high loads

never had the oil light come on yet but i do hear occasional whiney pump starvation noise when turning hard right. turning hard left is fine. so the poor stock baffle is prob letting the oil slosh out the low pan and starving the pickup briefly.
wonder if that could've also caused the stock engine to eventually smoke and blow the HG? will find out when i strip n assess the stock engine. didn't make any knocking worn bearing noise so might be just the HG
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
while looking at dry sumps i just had an idea. bear with me a moment while i sketch & design this new theory, tis like a sealed horizontal trap-door arrangement..
 
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
ok if the baffle was sealed round the edges with a large opening in the middle above the pickup it''d work like this:

when driving straight and level, the returning oil would gather on top of the baffle plate and gets sucked through the single hole and fills up the baffled chamber (since the chamber is sealed with two openings, the pump sucks oil out of the chamber via the pickup and the vacuum causes the pool of returning oil above to be sucked into the chamber to fill the void).

level.jpg


when turning left or right abruptly the g-force tries to tilt the oil to one side.

as the fluid is being forced diagonally rather than straight down with gravity, the large opening in the middle is now like the open top of a liquid container, determining the highest level of the liquid surface while the excess fluid simply overflows over the lip into a lower level.

with the surface of the fluid brought closer to the pickup, also gradually getting lower as the pump quickly drains the chamber yet the returning oil above can't easily flow back through the middle hole due to g-forces, it could potentially starve the pickup

left.jpg
right.jpg


To keep the fluid level above the pickup, a solution could be to have a fully sealed baffle chamber with a set of horizontal one-way trap-doors at both ends that only allows gas/fluid to flow into the chamber.
the trap doors are horizontal in order to keep as much oil in the baffled chamber.

when straight and level, both trap doors naturally drop open and allows the returning oil above to be sucked into the chamber

2 level.jpg


when turning abruptly, the oil inside tries to push its way out via the trap doors. the pressure of the flow moves the door till it closes against the baffle and seals, preventing the chamber from losing anymore oil and as a result keeps the oil level much higher above the pickup.

as a result, this provides more time before the level gets too low and starves the pickup.

meanwhile, the opposite door experiences vacuum into the chamber and stays open to allow any oil or air above to enter freely as the pump empties the chamber.

2 left.jpg
2 right.jpg


the first design of the trapdoor was this bent bracket but the lip edge of the flap, which is suppose to stop it opening to far, seemed vulnerable to fatiguing and bending up after a number of sudden openings and fail.

trapdoor 1.jpg


the second design was a simpler plate trap-door with a vertical cutout plate that stops it opening too far, which could also be part of the vertical baffle plates

trapdoor2.jpg


prob need to position more trap doors on the front and back to handle acceleration, braking as well as turning forces.
 
Last edited:
OP
OP
pollyp

pollyp

Club Member
k this is what i came up with

a.jpg


the disc in the middle of the pickup seals up against the pickup hole

b.jpg


vertical trap doors around the pickup

c.jpg


too tired to expain how it works, until tomorrow chaps
 
Last edited:
Top