trouble starting

[hazzeryoda]

Can anyone diagnose this problem?
Every time I start from cold, particularly in the mornings but not restricted, I get the engine going as normal but after about 2 or 3 secs it just farts out completely.
It takes three goes like this for it to fire up normally and keep going which is really frustrating...

Any clues? I've just replaced the cambelt but it was like this before the change. I changed spark plugs, dizzy cap, HT leads too...

Could it be something not pumping or possibly ignition? The battery is recent so it's not that...

H

 

[SammoHung]

sounds like it may be flooding too much with fuel....may be after 2 - 3 times the choke unwinder is warm enough to only be on part choke allowing the engine to run properly

check all your vacuum hoses are on firmly & not leaking....


run the car to full temp and have a drive THEN try next time to start from cold without touching the throttle peddle (without setting the semi auto choke) at all befire NOR while starting and see how it behaves??

next test
repeat the above at the next cold start following a hot normal drive....but set the choke on the smallest setting (press very lightly on the throttle peddle before starting untill you hear a feint click under the bonnet....and see how it behaves again

 

[hazzeryoda]

thanks sammo, will let you know how it goes after work

 

[hazzeryoda]

Right,

from cold with no gas, it takes a lot of sustained cranking to get it going and even then it rumbles and farts before eventually idling normally after i tap the gas pedal.

It is a similar story with the pedal slightly pressed, it even cuts out as well like this.

Any clues?

H

 

[solarice]

have you checked the fuel filter for blockages?

when it starts is it kickup out alot of smoke / smell alot of petrol ?

my old k10 had running probs would cut out all the time, switched the carb and all was well again...but i'd expect that to be your worst case.

 

[hazzeryoda]

Hi,

No petrol smell or smoke and I replaced the fuel filter recently!


I get an occaisional misfire on one cylinder when accelerating slowly uphill in 2nd/3rd at all engine temperatures, could this be linked?

H

 

[Micra 110]

Did you replace the Points and the Condenser with the HT leads and Dizzy?

Could be a faulty Condenser and/or Points.

 

[richj]

.

 

[hazzeryoda]

Micra110: No I didnt, good point, will change points, rotor arm and condenser soon.

richj: The battery is OK I think, it is under 2 years old and it doesn't high idle much.

Cheers or the ideas, it took 5 goes this morning!

H

 

[SammoHung]

did you manage to check all the vacuum hoses?...............

you can get a clue from this if you (assume) your timing is right.....you should have 12 degrees advance on idle....it will be less if theres a vaccum leak..........



......vacuum leaks will also **** with your carburettor too


....ANOTHER TEST:....next time it dies check each spark plug for colour & condition and look out for significant differences betwen each of them.......
but its normal for pots 1 & 4 to be slightly richer / sootier than the center two (2 & 3)

Another TEST:
after it eventually starts and runs....give it a gentle rev up...does if feel unbalanced (more severe vibration than usual....as if it were not firing on all 4 pots consistently?)

 

[hazzeryoda]

Right, Sammo:
I have no idea how to check the timing stuff that you mentioned, but just by visually checking, they look OK...

Next though, my number 3 spark plug is much more soiled than the others (all done under 2k miles), there is a little oil on the threads and most of the cone is black though still sparks well...

And what you said about inconsistent firing is about right, as I rev up slowly the engine speeds up gradually but at a certain point 'rumbles' or 'burbles/farts' a LITTLE bit but there is a definite hiccup in the rev-up which doesn't match what my foot is doing on the pedal...
When warm and at speeds around 30-40 when accelerating, the same 'farting' occurs and feels like a slight judder, losing a bit of power for a split-second. Misfire?

Apologies for lengthy description...!

Would it be worth just directly swapping my dizzy? or might there be a more insidious problem with the cylinders/rings etc? If so, which later dizzys can I swap with? I have a 1987 breakerpoint Mitsubishi with the internally mounted condenser.

Rotor arm, points and condenser to go in tomorrow...


H

 

[SammoHung]

My money is on electrix

Even though you can see it sparking in air it may be too weak in a rich choke mixture to ignite...and a sooty plug will make this even worse


rotor arm condenser & points are a good start as thease are a routine maintenance thing anyway...if you hit lucky this could solve it....before you try it....give that sooty plug a good clean up with some fuel and a rag or brush....may be do them all for goodmeasure...lol...and check / set the gaps before replacing them

...if this doesnt do it I would try a new plug (or if youre feeling generous...a new set)...avoid multi electrodes (waste of mone)....

finally there could be a problem with a lead on number 3.....these are more procey so I wouldnt buy a new set yet unless youre minted...I can send you a 'working' set...(or two sets) to try if nou need to investigate this at all..(let me know and I'll break out the jiffy bag)

the oilyness on number 3 plug is pretty common and is usually residual oil from filling that has spilled over the filing cap and just sits there in the plug well. from the sounds of your description the tip of teh plug is not oiled (its sooty) so I wouldnt stress about the rings...my guess is that theyre fine