EPS Power steering column, what ACTUALLY goes wrong?

Hiya my phone is playing up sorry.
My car was working fine until left for 4 days without starting on a geass verge.
I started it and back tyres had locked and light came on.
Light is on permanent and no power steering atm.
I have had a few obd's on there to erase any faults but none are showing?
A airbag light was on and whilst my friends computer was on it detected thus and removed it this is now gone.
I Live in luton an could possibly drive to u if need be thanks
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Another Micra escapes the scrap yard!

Glad I could resolve for you, you know where I am if you need me again.
 
@huttojb
What a great write up about the electric PSU in the Micra. Also how great it is to find a currently active forum about the very problem you are suffering from.
As you may have guessed I had the dreaded PS light come on last week, intermittently at first and now continuously. It’s my wife’s car and there’s no way she can drive it now. I’m in Olton, Solihull, not far from the TRW factory that you’ve mentioned, and so wondered if you could help.
Kevin
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
@huttojb
What a great write up about the electric PSU in the Micra. Also how great it is to find a currently active forum about the very problem you are suffering from.
As you may have guessed I had the dreaded PS light come on last week, intermittently at first and now continuously. It’s my wife’s car and there’s no way she can drive it now. I’m in Olton, Solihull, not far from the TRW factory that you’ve mentioned, and so wondered if you could help.
Kevin
Thank you. As discussed in message.
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
You continue, please tell me where your driving as I will make sure I am no where near your car!!

The NVM chip stores a lot more the fault codes,
Trim data, ECU calibration, Motor Calibration, Steering Boost Curve Data, production variance data and many more.

All NVM data are different because in production the systems are tuned to be stable. Good luck and I would take the post off because when you crash I wonder if your insurance will take this as none validated!!!
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Take a look at my topic it can be a solution
moderated
I wonder WHEN someone crashes, what legal action are going to take on you!?

Anyone taking this advise PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE be careful!
 
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Are you an esp seller?
What can it be? Craziest thing is just steering wheel becomes hard as it has faults. There is no locking or sth else


After I read your messages I understand that YES you are an ESP seller. I AM SORRY BUT YOU CANNOT CHEAT PEOPLE ANYMORE.
 
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huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Lol, you have no clue. But you crack on mate. I only help people, happy to step back and allow you to continue.

Maybe I’d share one day all that I know. I used to work with the systems and worked where it was manufactured and developed! I use the systems for another purpose and not for Micra’s.

I helped people and trust me, didn’t make a lot out of it, most times just broke even!

But as you feel your way is better I’ll point everyone at you.
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Are you an esp seller?
What can it be? Craziest thing is just steering wheel becomes hard as it has faults. There is no locking or sth else


After I read your messages I understand that YES you are an ESP seller. I AM SORRY BUT YOU CANNOT CHEAT PEOPLE ANYMORE.

I haven't replied to your message properly because frankly I was a little upset of the comment that I Cheat people. But as you think you know better I will guarantee I will not be helping anymore people out with their EPS. Like I said previously, I use the Nissan System in other applications (See here -
) like Kit Cars, boats etc.. and this gives me alot more satisfaction then giving the systems for Micra's. Unfortunately I do not have a Micra and have no interest in Micras, I helped someone, who recommended me to someone else and so on…. It was never planned. I only did this to help people. But as some people think they know better I will step back and see how many people end up in a wall.

I did use to work for TRW and been looking through a few old paperwork’s about NVM and what is configured in them, I found a few old pictures which I can share and show exactly what is in each NVM. Like I said previously, each NVM is tuned to the system during manufacturing to ensure stability of the system. I have attached the NVM contents below what I had found in my old paperwork, but there is more like Tune Data, Memory Maps for different Engine types, Maintenance Data etc... And you really think by hot swapping the NVM IC it won’t cause an accident! I hope you provide people your name so they can contact you afterwards.

The other thing I haven't even SPOKE about is removing the column and the negative impact this will have to Side Load, Absolute Steering Position, Index Position.... I can go on forever, I worked at TRW for 10 Years on the Nissan K12 System, you really think I do not know what I am talking about!!!!.... but I'm sure people will find out the issues they are going to experience. Do you really think there were no sofware updated, what do you think is going to happen if you get the NVM IC from a different Software Unit, do you really think the Configurations are in the same Memory Location....??

Your comment about there is no locking etc, I have seen it all, Self Steering, Notchy Steering, locking and freeing. but you will find this out. To be honest, I'm so set of proving you wrong, I might even Do something on my Kit Car to demostarte exactly what can happen and put it on YouTube just for you...

Anyway, signing off for the last time on this forum and will hope everyone is safe. Please please take this into consideration before doing as suggested because honestly, I am saying this for you, your family and other road users safety!

Hope everyone gets their system sorted one way or another!

NVM Data Parameters

NVMData1.PNG
NVMData2.PNG
 
When an unthinking person makes ill thought through unsubstantiated, illogical irrational comments, it not necessary to stop doing proven productive useful good work serving others!
 
Just because some no-it-all posts an insulting comment, please do not stop giving proven advise on this forum.
As an aside, micrapowers, just because you can drive with a faulty eps, what else is going to go wrong, possibly with fatal consequences. Imho you are an idiot who should not be allowed within six feet of a steering wheel!
 
Hi huttojb. Absolutely. Your advice appears sound, & I for one could not care less whether or not you make money if you work on someones car.
I stand by my previous post (micapowers) that anyone who knowingly uses a car with a faulty steering system (or brakes, shockers, or any other potentially fatal fault) should not be allowed anywhere near the driving seat of a car.
If this is considered abuse then I apologise for the post, but not for the sentiment.
 
@ [B]huttojb[/B] each to their own however after reading through the threads i 100% agree with you.
You are doing a fantastic job and keeping cars on the road without compromising anyone's safety.

My 2010 k12 touch wood is doing mighty fine however it would be nice to have your contact details if i or anyone i know has potential issues you could help out with.

If you don't mind sharing your contact number please drop me a message.
Cheers
 
Interesting thread. Mine isn't faulty, but was wondering what are the usual failures when they go?

Why did they code them to the car? The NATS and lack of engine starting should be enough to stop it being stolen.
 
Good to see another K12 saved from the EPS planned obsolescence economic write off syndrome. Many more, way to go? :)
I've been reading the thread and I was thinking this the entire time

The whole thing seems very contrived, especially Nissan not having the ability to repair their own car because of using a 3rd party company who aren't sharing their intellectual property - it means they have plausible deniability and the ability to turn away the repairs when they come in, forcing people to have no choice but to replace their cars.

Vote for and demand consumer rights laws and consumer protection, this is wrong.
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
I've been reading the thread and I was thinking this the entire time

The whole thing seems very contrived, especially Nissan not having the ability to repair their own car because of using a 3rd party company who aren't sharing their intellectual property - it means they have plausible deniability and the ability to turn away the repairs when they come in, forcing people to have no choice but to replace their cars.

Vote for and demand consumer rights laws and consumer protection, this is wrong.
Hey. I think most components now in vehicles take this model. As the eps is determined in the DFMEA as a safety critical device it has no repair schemes. But most sub-assemblies on a vehicle will have this approach. If the BCM failed, would you see Nissan taking it apart and fixing it, no; it’s just a hot swap with a new one. Same as any sub-assy on a car!

Don’t forget, the same product in theory was also fitted to the Modus, Magane, Fiat Stilo. And then Gen2 on Ford Fiesta, Fiat bravo.. etc. So it’s not easy for businesses to release technical information. This is for most companies, does your company release all their know-how.

I agree the security feature was abit much, not sure where this idea came from but it was a Nissan requirement but think this was to stop hot swapping from one car to another due to configuration and map selection to that specific car. But each to their own!!

Hope I gave alittle bit more details. Always here to help.

Jason
 
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Hey. I think most components now in vehicles take this model. As the eps is determined in the DFMEA as a safety critical device it has no repair schemes. But most sub-assemblies on a vehicle will have this approach. If the BCM failed, would you see Nissan taking it apart and fixing it, no; it’s just a hot swap with a new one. Same as any sub-assy on a car!

Don’t forget, the same product in theory was also fitted to the Modus, Magane, Fiat Stilo. And then Gen2 on Ford Fiesta, Fiat bravo.. etc. So it’s not easy for businesses to release technical information. This is for most companies, does your company release all their know-how.

I agree the security feature was abit much, not sure where this idea came from but it was a Nissan requirement but think this was to stop hot swapping from one car to another due to configuration and map selection to that specific car. But each to their own!!

Hope I gave alittle bit more details. Always here to help.

Jason
I understand, just nostalgia for a simpler time I guess where your steering wheel didn't need a computer on it and a password. They could be built in such a way that they could be swapped out for scrap parts so that people can repair their own cars when they break but they aren't for money reasons - I'm thinking like how DVD's are region locked in that case. So if one car has a configuration it can only use EPS that have the same, but to make each EPS specific to only one car is a bit much imo

It's only going to get worse the more complex the systems get on cars, it's already happened with things like phones where you no longer have the right to repair your own phone you have to send it back to the company now. Farmers apparently have the same trouble with their tractors in the US, where they used to be able to drive them down the road and have any mechanic fix it, now they have to put it on a trailer and ship it 600 miles to the closest servicing centre - I found out about that one from environmentalists mad about the wasted fuel
 
Hi. I have a 2005 sport+ k12 and the power steering has coincidentally failed a few days after getting work on steering done for MOT, I was considering replacing the steering column myself but after reading more it seems the security feature would be an issue.
Mechanic read fault code: 1606
Would you be willing to help me, huttojb?
I have been driving without power steering for about a week and on the bright side it seems to help smoother driving as you can feel the resistance to turning a lot more.
 
Hi
I've just joined this forum as my son's 55 plate Micra's power steering has just failed again this morning.
The PS light came on initially on the 30th Sept. After attempting to recover his car using my Transit van and a towing bar, which resulted in his towing eye shearing off, I drove his car to my local garage. They cleared the fault and the car has been fine since a 23rd Dec when the PS light came on again. Another trip to the garage and another £30 to clear the fault. This lasted 5 days and it's gone again.
I'm not remotely technically minded and am at complete loss as to how to go about fixing this issue without spending more than the car is worth.
Any help would be much appreciated.

Andy
 
Could i please have some help. My daughter had had this same problem. It was reset only 2 weeks ago and she was told it had already been reset once before. Best to sell as of it goes again it will be an expensive fix...
She only bought the car in january.. and has not
even paid in full for it yet...
Well it happened again at the weekend could not make an emergeny appt...
She is so upset. This and everything else going on and she is trying to help others...
She thinks she has to scrap the car....
Can anyone help in warwickshire...
Car has been left on roadside...
 
Hi, I just registered on the forum to find out about this problem as I have just brought a 2003 Micra and 2 days later the steering light is on with no power steering!
could you please send me your number huttojb!
thanks!
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Not really. There was component failures within certain dates but then it depends on the 8D when it was contained and resolved.
so depending on the manufacturer date can give a clue what could be the failure mode. i monitored the warranty performance and we had over 150+ failure modes. So it’s not as easy. Like I said previously the DTC are groups of internal failures. For example, the motor DTC (can’t remember what it is) but this could be;
Motor phase faults
Motor drive failures ie FETs
Microprocessor fault
Software fault
Feedback sensor fault
The circuitry around the FET control
The circuitry around feedback control
The circuitry around the relay control
Etc...
Just out of memory I can probably think of 25+ internal fault codes for this single DTC.
Without plugging in I think it’s pretty impossible to fault find.
jason
 
So no common fault, just lots of random faults. Was just thinking if one part commonly failed then there might be an easy(-ish) fix for people.
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
There was a few common faults but I wouldn’t shotgun this approach to all eps failures.
One awkward thing is removing the column to get to the ECU cover, in production these was assembled in suck a way not to cause side load on the torque disk. When people remove the column they are making it unsafe when reassembled, maybe causing side load and the unit may see input torque that’s not really there.
I wish I could send photos of the machine that attached that column to the gearbox, it was ridiculous. For a 4 screw operation to attach 2 sub-assemblies together the amount of issues the OE plant had just to stop side load was amazing.
the eps is very complex and people probably do not realise the complexity with the system. I loved it, one of the best products I worked on. I loved my job at TRW and miss it loads, but working in the aerospace industry now is a lot more financial rewarding.
maybe one day I’ll get around to doing a YouTube video explaining it all.
 

huttojb

Club Member
EPS System Guru
Well. Have you ever tried to steer it without your eps. You be surprised. Pull the fuse and try it. :p
 

frank

Club Member
Well. Have you ever tried to steer it without your eps. You be surprised. Pull the fuse and try it. :p
thats because its geared to suit
i used to drive a 7.5 ton truck with no p/s (d series)
we are all turning into wimps with girly arms
 
thats because its geared to suit
i used to drive a 7.5 ton truck with no p/s (d series)
we are all turning into wimps with girly arms
Power steering is not necessary but is a “sales & marketing gadget must have “ extra that sells cars to the uninformed.

I always avoid vehicles (Micras) with P/S as when it fails, the cost of repair renders the vehicle as an economic write off & MOT failure. :(
 
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