Micra - Mini

[frank]

yeh, i had the same problem on the red car, and that was a preface loom and preface ecu, yours is a facelift loom and preface ecu iirc

 

[Nelly_mini]

Subframe modifications.. Seam welded the top, Chopped the front off and put a brace bar between the struts.. Thanks lads

Anyone who knows mini subframes will see that part of the frame has been cut and folded, then seam welded for strength.. These buggers are tough to cut, at some parts they have about 3 faces to cut through >_<

 

[Nelly_mini]

Progress!!! Been told this may only take another 2 weeks to complete the frame.

So far the frame has been fabbed by just measurements.. next job tomorrow is to introduce the engine and cut the frame away from it

 

[l_jonez]

Nice to see youd making sone progress,You really should use a jig when building the frame though. From building mine I'd say the sump will hit those rails.

 

[Nelly_mini]

I agree to both comments but its being made by a fella who builds hot rods for a living.. he seems to know what he is doing and has measured everything a million times and used alot of measuring tools ive never even seen before lol.. I still agree that it isnt going to fit though!!!

 

[Nelly_mini]

Well i've been messed around with constantly with every aspect of this conversion. So. We are putting a standard 998 engine in to run for now, whilst the mini is running im going to strip the micra out completely and scrap what i dont need ( If anyone needs a shell it will be up for grabs one day!) Hopefully doing it this way will get around all those people that have let me down on parts. AAAAnnnndddd, i think on saturday i am buying a pretty much almost complete subframe to take the 1.3 engine. So, sorry there has been no updates but there will soon! (if anyone wants some rear seats from the micra for free give me a shout!)

 

[Magpie42]

Ooooh, extra rear seats....

*imagines Micra people-carrier*

*gets taxi licence*

 

[Nelly_mini]

Im back!
Its been a long time of being messed around, ripped off and let down with this project and i lost my patience with it.
I gave up trying with it and fitted a 1330 A series instead. its developed a massive oil leak so thats got to come out soon too. So on the off chance i sent around some emails asking about the conversion etc and to my surprise was sent the offer of buying a complete conversion. Frame, engine, wiring loom and ancillaries included!

I'm in the process of getting it delivered and figuring out what parts to use etc.
A few issues Ive come up against:

The engine is a 1.0 coil pack, i have a 1.3 non coil pack that id prefer to fit - I've got to change the wiring loom
Subframe is a twin bolt, my shell is a single bolt - got to modify it in some way.
The frame wont allow the standard inlet manifold without cutting the bulkhead - is there an alternative apart from bike carbs? its a tight space!
The standard exhaust manifold is fat and bulky - need to find a way to make more space up front.
Got to cut the inner wings away to squeeze it all in..
The spi tank only puts out 1 bar - im sure ive read the micra needs 3 bar?

So yep, im back and will get this conversion done eventually.. Any help with the above would be great!

 

[frank]

there is some manifold advice on your previous page niki, and you could run 1 bar of fuel pressure if you fit bigger injectors

 

[l_jonez]

Swap the spi pump for an mpi item. Simples.

Potentially you could swap the 1.3 internals into the 1.0 to keep the coil packs, trigger wheel and cam sensor.


As for the subframes its a lot of work to convert from one to the other as you have to modify the bulkhead

 

[l_jonez]

Also some pics of the frame would be good

 

[Nelly_mini]

Its tomms' old frame (on TMF) that he had fitted to his mk2 mini. Been talking for while now about getting it over to me - hes going to convert it from a twin bolt to single bolt before bringing it over
I'm going to fit the micra fuel pump inside the spi tank - that will provide the correct pressure.
Got a k series exhaust manifold here to modify too. Just need to get it all here and work out whats what..

 

[l_jonez]

Not sure I'd be happy with converting the frame. The towers are are the most critical part of the frame.

 

[Nelly_mini]

He is going to bore out the central hole in the 2 bolt frame and weld a nut onto the back of hole (to accept a normal towerbolt) and then weld up and reinforce the holes that were previously there. Hes spoken to a few engineering friends and have found this the most effective way of doing it. It will need to be put onto a car to line everything up to ensure nothing is put on wrong!

I may buy a junker of a car to run whilst i do this engine conversion - its gonna take longer than we thought!

 

[l_jonez]

Don't forget the floor will need to be drilled (probably best to weld in reinforcement plates) to accept the frame as well

 

[Nelly_mini]

Don't forget the floor will need to be drilled (probably best to weld in reinforcement plates) to accept the frame as well

That shouldnt be an issue, ive got some thick steel plate hanging around that i was originally going to use for to fab up some engine mounts. Bought a toyota corolla inlet (1997) - going to use parts off this for a custom inlet

 

[Nelly_mini]

So.... Im back again!! After feeling that Toms conversion wasnt right for nelly i gave up on the idea. Then i heard all the reviews about the allspeed frames (wasnt so sure on them to begin with!)
I bought a 1.0 pre facelift to have all the running gear off it to be mated with a small 1.0 box for extra zip

Im stuck on a few parts though if anyone can help? I have the version of NATS which is only on the fob and no chips on the key at all.. Almost looks like an aftermarket immobilser really. I want to keep the engine fault light from my clocks - does anyone know which wire this is? Its the set of clocks without the rev counter and has a mechanical speedo if that helps?
Going to keep the fault reading plug too for extra security should anything go wrong. Its so confusing cutting these wires out of the car! no mistakes made yet though

 

[frank]

if its like the old metro one niki ? then its nats 1 and easy to bypass, and there are wiring diags in the pdf manual eh

 

[Nelly_mini]

exactly like that! to be honest due to its simplicity Id like to leave it in place, a little extra security for Nelly once shes done. Do you know if it runs through the clocks or not? some people are having issues with nats and removing the clocks - i think its the newer ones though? where is this PDF manual you speak of?
In terms of the engine bay loom I havn't removed any of the plugs - Ive spotted quite a lot of plugs that are unused - any idea what they are? -
Such a pain in the bum as ive had to leave it all wired up so i can check it works each time i snip something.
Currently i have the fuel tank sender and pump wiring still installed + the clocks ( With a few bits snipped), ECU, NATS, bits of the fusebox + the entire front loom -Ive removed all extra bits like stalk related stuff, hazards / demister / heater / fogs etc. I know all the fellas around me are acting like its a simple job but seeing as i know nothing about electronics - pretty much teaching myself alongside a some awesome advice on here I dont think ive done bad for a girly haha!.

 

[frank]

its basically a prenats ecu with a separate immobiliser box niki, and the manual download link is on here somewhere
i would,nt cut any wires till you have unwrapped all the the looms and laid them out on the floor personally

 

[Nelly_mini]

Thats the stage I'm at now Ive snipped all the obviously useless stuff out - Now to remove it all and look at it in closer detail, I tell you unwrapping a loom whilst its still in the car is a pain haha. And a note to anyone doing this in the future - take the indicator / wiper stalks off before trying to remove the dash!
Tomorrow im going to work at removing the engine excited! if i remove the front of the car will it pull out the front rather than have to be lifted?

 

[1275]

Yes just cut the cross member off with a hacksaw.

 

[Nelly_mini]

Righty, after i accidently locked myself off the forum im back haha.
Subframe has been ordered, an exhaust flange is being made and the micra has been stripped and scrapped.
Im wondering if a frankspeed manifold would be a better idea rather than fabbing an exhaust system up? - then once im on the road look at creating a 4/1 mani myself.
If anyone has one for sale please let me know. Also been reading up about the hybrid clutch plate - i think il be needing to do this, i already have a 1.3 plate and i can use the center piece from the 1.0 clutch i got from the junkers engine.
Nelly is officially off the road so il start stripping her this weekend.

 

[Nelly_mini]

Im having second thoughts about this clutch fitment after reading porks turbo topic.. seems he had trouble with different flywheels fitting?
I have a 1.3 lightened flywheel from Frank, which i was hoping to fit onto my engine (1.3 facelift) + a 1.3 gearbox but no fittings and no driveshafts.
I do however have a full 1.0 pre facelift engine with flywheel, clutch and Gbox attached with driveshafts. The frame i have ordered means i must use the 1.0 box ( plus i want the quicker accel).
So can i bodge any parts together to make a working unit? by the looks of it on porks page the flywheels wont fit between pre and facelift models - leaving me to use the lightened 1.3 wheel - but will this fit in the 1.0 box? im so confused!!
Also by what frank has said it would be best to use the 1.3 clutch ( 180mm) with the 1.0 ( 160mm) center part to allow correct fitment.. am i going mad?!

 

[frank]

the prefacelift 1.0 g/box needs the shallower f/w niki, and the hybrid clutch is an upgrade for that setup.
the 1.3 and facelift 1.0 f/w has a deeper dish

 

[Nelly_mini]

So in order it from left to right will go F/L 1.3 engine, Pre F/L flywheel (1.0?) - do they bolt on in correct fitment?, Pre F/L clutch spline center mated to a 180mm 1.3 clutch "ring of grippy bit". All inside the pre facelift 1.0 box.
I hope that makes sense! my worry is will the pre facelift F/w fit the 1.3 facelift engine?

 

[frank]

the f/w,s and engines fit/swap ok, but the clutch arm on the prefacelift 1.0 g/box is closer to the engine (hence the shallower dish on the f/w) and the input spline and thrust bearing are smaller too
the smaller RS5F41 g/box is more suited to mini,s really, and they handle 130+hp no probs (i,ve been running them for 8 years now )

 

[Nelly_mini]

Will i need to change the clutch arm and thrust bearing then? also im not sure what you mean by the input spline - is this what goes through the clutch?

 

[frank]

there,s no way round it really niki, the smaller RS5F41 g/box will only fit the preface 1.0 f/w and preface 1.0 clutch pressure plate

 

[Nelly_mini]

So il be using the setup i wrote above then? then i can use a hydraulic clutch setup i guess to eliminate the clutch arm problems?

 

[frank]

you might be able to fit a hydraulic concentric slave cylinder from another car ? then spacers the starter motor maybe ?

 

[Nelly_mini]

spacers the starter motor? awh you mean im going to have issues with the starter motor too? i thought they were all interchangeable?
I dont know how i can make this right!

 

[frank]

yeh, the deeper dish on the 1.3 f/w means that the starter ring gear wont mesh unless you spacer the starter motor (no biggie )

 

[l_jonez]

This is why I bangged on about just using the 1.3 g/box on other forums, they fit with no problem and offer better FD options. What frame have you got?

Allspeed made a frame for the 1.0 but after some criticism now offer a frame suitable for the 1.3 box.

 

[1275]

Quote taken from this thread. http://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/topic/287671-allspeed-cg13de-micra-build/

The frame is very good quality, there are some issues i would like to mention:

- You really have to use allspeed bottom arms as the mounts are for rose joints, i did find a forum thread that said apparently minispares's rose joint kit will fit but they were out of stock.

- The rear engine mount fouls the pot joint once you put a boot on it.

- The rear engine mount replaces the Nissan one, which is fine apart from the nissan one did a vital role of also being the mount for the gear lever steady bar. So i had to weld on an extra strip of metal and bend it to as closer position as the original as i could, this could have been so much simpler and very quick for them to do if it was already on the rear mount.

- As mentioned earlier up the thread, the inner arches. it seemingly would have been achievable to narrow the side braces in just 1cm or so to make it clear the inner arches. but you could always weld on some sheet metal back as an inner arch in as i will no doubt do.

- the brake pipe mounting tabs for the flexible's seem flimsy as they bend with little effort, also very high compared to standard. I've not seen an issue with it yet but it might be a little tight on full lock.

- it would have been nice to have a factory painted option like the other frames.

 

[Nelly_mini]

The reason i wanted the 1.0 box frame was due to the gearing and the fact i already have all the parts required. My only concern is can it be done? If it can then im going ahead with it. Ive ordered the lower arms and tiebars so shouldnt have issues there. The fella doesnt offer a fix for the potjoint fouling? Im sure i can create a bracket to sort the gear linkage steady also.

 

[Nelly_mini]

Plus after seeing a post on here im sure the final drive can be changed? Something about changing the diff etc?

 

[frank]

the preface 1.0 diff is 4.05:1, and the 1.3 is 3.9:1 niki, so there is,nt a lot of difference tbh, but the 1.3 fifth gear is taller tho

 

[Nelly_mini]

It should be fine for me, i dont plan on motorway driving that often (rarely infact). I know i can do this.just need to get my head round it!
I Can do it! Hopefully this will prove a few men i know wrong, none of them have faith!

 

[frank]

you might be able to fit a hydraulic concentric slave cylinder from another car ? then spacers the starter motor maybe ?

i had a look round the yards this morning niki, and you should be able to fit a concentric slave cylinder no probs (some just slip over the snout) or else bolt a plate onto where i drilled the ventilation holes on this pic, then bolt the csc onto the plate
have none of the mini guys done it before ?

 

[1275]

Post 60 should be of interest, not the best of photos though. http://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/topic/287671-allspeed-cg13de-micra-build/page-4

 

[Nelly_mini]

Thank you both of you ive read that topic already which is where i got the idea from. I will try and source the parts so i can mock it all up on the engine before fitment. Frank when you say slip over the snout do you mean hooking onto the clutch lever arm?

 

[frank]

nah, these are the concentric type niki (fitted to most cars nowadays) they slide over the input shaft and push directly onto the pressure plate (no arm or lever) most are bolted down, but 1 that i saw in the yard was very low profile and just slid onto the snout that surrounds the input shaft (in the middle of that pic ^)

 

[Nelly_mini]

Oh wow i see what you mean! Will need to get my hands on one to see hows best to fit it. Thank you, that looks alot simplerto use how would i make sure its only moving the correct amount?

 

[frank]

Oh wow i see what you mean! Will need to get my hands on one to see hows best to fit it. Thank you, that looks alot simplerto use how would i make sure its only moving the correct amount?

the dia of your master cylinder will determine how much throw you have niki, as long as its a similar dia to the donor car, and as long as its resting position is gently touching the pressure plate it should work fine

 

[Nelly_mini]

changed my order to a 1.3 frame, this fuss with clutches etc is too confusing!
the lead time on the frame means i will be getting the frame into the new year - i dont mind this as it leaves me time to build up the engine.
Today i fitted the cam cover back on to protect all the insides and begun to strip the 1.0 engine ( bit pointless now i guess!)
One thing i noticed is i slotted the pot joint from the 1.0 engine into the 1.3 box and it fit? - i thought there was a difference? im not sure now haha.
Anyway, tomorrow i will fit the mech speedo drive to the 1.3 box and start to build up the flywheel / clutch etc so it can all be sealed up.
Its such a headache but i think im just overthinking things.. :/

 

[Nelly_mini]

Plus.. an odd question but does gearbox oil always smell like REALLY bad B.O? a load of it fell out the 1.0 box today and my whole shed now stinks of it.. its a lingering smell too and i cant get rid of it >_<

 

[1275]

Yep it's nasty nasty stuff.

 

[frank]

Yep it's nasty nasty stuff.

aye, tis one of the reasons that i run engine oil in mine

 

[davyboy]

aye, tis one of the reasons that i run engine oil in mine

Interesting frank. What viscosity ? thinner than the standard gear oil though surely.
Makes the gear change different ? easier ? lifespan ? so many questions LOL