GA16 Conversion - Advice and Guidance.

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
Hey guys

I know this topic has been covered a million times, and yes i have used the search button but i cant find much anymore :S not sure if its been deleted im not sure.

So here goes:

I was going to do a turbo conversion, but i think ive changed my mind (for the moment) to 1.6 conversion.

Basically, i want to keep the 1.3 gearbox, driveshafts, gearlinkages etc. I know this requires (or does it?) trimming the chassis rail to fit the water pump, although ive heard that you can get a electric pump.

I know the mounts need modifying, but how exactly? do they need moving? spacing? its not clear.

Is there anyone here whos done the conversion (any method) who can can advice and maybe list which steps they took, costs etc?

Thanks in advance guys.
 

frank

Club Member
if you want to retain the stock shafts, 3 of the mounts wont be affected (only the offside upper one will need modding) and you may be able to portopwer the offside chassis out a bit instead of cutting into it :grinning:
 
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SuluR

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
So its a direct fit on 3 mounts, What exactly needs modding to that mount? (is it the mount on drivers side?). I know that the 1.3 box has the starter motor through it, besides that is a direct fit. Can i use the loom from the micra?

There isnt much info towards what exactly needs modding on the mounts. And any other problems people face.

Cheers guys
 

Stani1029

Club Member
im not 100% on this but here goes:

1.6 is a direct fit when using an electric waterpump if your not wanting to cut chassis. only LHS mount needs re-done. you can use the 1.3 flywheel/clutch/gearbox/shafts and if you use the micra throttle body on the 1.6 inlet (straight swap) most of the loom will plug on. some sensors may need swapping but thats not hard. this is one conversion i really want to have a go at. and once running turbo it!!
 
Not sure i like the sound of bending the chassis frank? Imo you would do better to get an electric water pump:)

the cg13 clutch is a bit of a limitation though eh stani?
 

Stani1029

Club Member
not a helix one :D the only thing with the electric water pump ive heard is that if they break you cant tell whilst driving and then that means engine overheat
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
sorry to say this but some of these are questions you shouldn't have to ask. if you need to ask how the mount needs to be modified then you are doing it the wrong way.

all the people who have done this convertion, started by taking out the micra engine and dropping in the 1.6 engine. then they looked at it and could see what needed moving and how far etc.

this is actually a very easy convertion and really it should be done on the fly. you can't just have a mount made up and then do the convertion and have the mount fit in perfectly, you need to mesure it all after the engine is in.

i recommend you get the parts and start doing what you know and then check back if you run into a problem. and if you can't have the car standing with its engine half out because its your daily driver etc, then you shouldn't be doing this mod. its something that takes time and playing about to get it just right, and not a quick weekend job. if you rush this to get it done then you could make your car very dangerous. i have seen some shocking engine convertions, some of which have fallen out on the motorway due to bad welding. don't let that be you!

anyway good luck, we are here to help, but its better to have a question that is directly relivent, eg something you can photograph and post up, because the questions you are asking now are ones you will find the answers to as you go along.
 

frank

Club Member
here,s a pic of one with a chassis cut :eek:
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SuluR

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
sorry to say this but some of these are questions you shouldn't have to ask. if you need to ask how the mount needs to be modified then you are doing it the wrong way.

all the people who have done this convertion, started by taking out the micra engine and dropping in the 1.6 engine. then they looked at it and could see what needed moving and how far etc.

this is actually a very easy convertion and really it should be done on the fly. you can't just have a mount made up and then do the convertion and have the mount fit in perfectly, you need to mesure it all after the engine is in.

i recommend you get the parts and start doing what you know and then check back if you run into a problem. and if you can't have the car standing with its engine half out because its your daily driver etc, then you shouldn't be doing this mod. its something that takes time and playing about to get it just right, and not a quick weekend job. if you rush this to get it done then you could make your car very dangerous. i have seen some shocking engine convertions, some of which have fallen out on the motorway due to bad welding. don't let that be you!

anyway good luck, we are here to help, but its better to have a question that is directly relivent, eg something you can photograph and post up, because the questions you are asking now are ones you will find the answers to as you go along.

Thanks for the advice NeX. Im still on early stages right now so i was just asking of what experiances people have had before i jump too ahead of myself. Im still planning and have much to learn :)

It would be nice to see how other 1.6 conversions went and how they tackeled any problems.


here,s a pic of one with a chassis cut :eek:
attachment.php

Is that even safe? lol
 

Glen

Club Member
when i get my shafts made im going to get a few made. The proper way to fit a 1.6 is to move the gearbox. it requires shafts being made but you dont have to cut chassi legs or use electric water pumps as thats just stupid. I should make a kit like they do for the corsa redtops.
 

Shaun

***StaGGeRed***
when i get my shafts made im going to get a few made. The proper way to fit a 1.6 is to move the gearbox. it requires shafts being made but you dont have to cut chassi legs or use electric water pumps as thats just stupid. I should make a kit like they do for the corsa redtops.
would make some money at least :D good idea though! (Y)
 
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SuluR

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
when i get my shafts made im going to get a few made. The proper way to fit a 1.6 is to move the gearbox. it requires shafts being made but you dont have to cut chassi legs or use electric water pumps as thats just stupid. I should make a kit like they do for the corsa redtops.

Wow that sounds promising. How much will they cost?

Would that mean the 1.6 gearbox? or still the 1.3 on it?

I would definatly be interested in a set :)
 

Glen

Club Member
would be a 1.6 gearbox or a 1.3 and ill get a place to make the mount brackets aswell that all you do is weld these brackets into ur existing bracket and redrill the hole
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
Thanks for the advice NeX. Im still on early stages right now so i was just asking of what experiances people have had before i jump too ahead of myself. Im still planning and have much to learn :)

It would be nice to see how other 1.6 conversions went and how they tackeled any problems.

theres no problem in asking questions, i did the same with my first engine swap, i asked all about any kind of problems i might run into, but in the end it was just easier to do it and see the problems for myself :)
 

ollyc98

Ex. Club Member
Cutting the chassis isn't a problem IMO. There's space to add a reinforcing plate. A 10mm thick plate welded/bolted to the length of the chassis leg would do it :p Old cars had unboxed chassis legs and they were ok (ish) so if you beefed up the area around the cutout it'd be almost as strong as before. It's not like you'd be running enough power to flex the chassis.
 

Alexx117

STI
Club Member
i'd be more inclined to slap a sr20 in there lol and seriously glen if you were make up a kit say for the ga16 engine and box then i can see youd get a fair few customers and make yourself some profit (Y)
 

micras69

Deactivated Account
It's not going to happen it's cheeper to have it all made up yourself. I can supply the lot for £500 that Inc engine and custom shafts I've posted this up before and it's all the same people are all for it but don't follow through with the cash it's the same with the tubular manifold I can do for the cg and the ga engines i've got a k11 in my lockup that has a ga16 in (not plumbed or wired) and it's not hard to do! Once I have the 1.3 turbo'd I'll be turboing the 1.6 as it has soooo much more potential like 300bhp with little effort potential
 

Stani1029

Club Member
when i get my shafts made im going to get a few made. The proper way to fit a 1.6 is to move the gearbox. it requires shafts being made but you dont have to cut chassi legs or use electric water pumps as thats just stupid. I should make a kit like they do for the corsa redtops.

what shafts did you use when you had it running late last year when it blew up??
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
It's not going to happen it's cheeper to have it all made up yourself. I can supply the lot for £500 that Inc engine and custom shafts I've posted this up before and it's all the same people are all for it but don't follow through with the cash it's the same with the tubular manifold I can do for the cg and the ga engines i've got a k11 in my lockup that has a ga16 in (not plumbed or wired) and it's not hard to do! Once I have the 1.3 turbo'd I'll be turboing the 1.6 as it has soooo much more potential like 300bhp with little effort potential

off topic question, have you done any SR20 work? i am going to engine swap the cab, and i am still in two minds between the 1.6 and the 2.0, but the one thing i am not sure about is how you mesure the size for custom shafts? as the distance between the gearbox and wheels changes depending on if its on the ground or on jacks etc, how do you work out the right length?

anyway back on topic,
 

Stani1029

Club Member
It's not going to happen it's cheeper to have it all made up yourself. I can supply the lot for £500 that Inc engine and custom shafts I've posted this up before and it's all the same people are all for it but don't follow through with the cash it's the same with the tubular manifold I can do for the cg and the ga engines i've got a k11 in my lockup that has a ga16 in (not plumbed or wired) and it's not hard to do! Once I have the 1.3 turbo'd I'll be turboing the 1.6 as it has soooo much more potential like 300bhp with little effort potential

well how about you show us exactly what your offering for £500, detailed pics of the engine fitment, shafts etc...??? and if i were you #### the 1.3 turbo and continue the 1.6 if 300bhp is easily achievable
 

Stani1029

Club Member
off topic question, have you done any SR20 work? i am going to engine swap the cab, and i am still in two minds between the 1.6 and the 2.0, but the one thing i am not sure about is how you mesure the size for custom shafts? as the distance between the gearbox and wheels changes depending on if its on the ground or on jacks etc, how do you work out the right length?

anyway back on topic,

thats why it makes sense to use the cg stuff, and either cut the chassis of use an electric waterpump :) and im guessing you measure the shafts off the ground with the cv's in place, there wont be much size difference from on/off the ground
 

frank

Club Member
the one thing i am not sure about is how you mesure the size for custom shafts? as the distance between the gearbox and wheels changes depending on if its on the ground or on jacks etc, how do you work out the right length?
,

the spiders in the inboard CV,s are allowed to float in and out nex, so they need less than fully extended when jacked up and less than fully inserted when the shafts are level/horizontal :grinning:
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
the spiders in the inboard CV,s are allowed to float in and out nex, so they need less than fully extended when jacked up and less than fully inserted when the shafts are level/horizontal :grinning:

so you take two mesurements then, one when they are fully jacked and the wheels are as low as they go, and one when the CV and the gearbox are exactly opposite, and then work out from that what they would have to be, which would be something between the two but not over those distances or they will either bottom out or fall out yea?
 

frank

Club Member
there,s a fair bit of leaway nex, you can see in the pic that the spider has been riding in the middle of the potjoint (with about 10mm of float) and it would still work ok if the shaft was compressed or extended another 25mm or more
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NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
yea and thats just on the inside one isn't it? so that means you have about 25mm to play with, but then i suppose it doesn't move that much really? its not like there is a meter of travel on the suspentionn
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
thats why it makes sense to use the cg stuff, and either cut the chassis of use an electric waterpump :) and im guessing you measure the shafts off the ground with the cv's in place, there wont be much size difference from on/off the ground

i had a micra with a 1.6 and a cut chassis, and on a hard corner it still grinded, i suppose i could have got stiffer bushes etc but its just not worth it, its far too close.
 
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SuluR

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
It's not going to happen it's cheeper to have it all made up yourself. I can supply the lot for £500 that Inc engine and custom shafts I've posted this up before and it's all the same people are all for it but don't follow through with the cash it's the same with the tubular manifold I can do for the cg and the ga engines i've got a k11 in my lockup that has a ga16 in (not plumbed or wired) and it's not hard to do! Once I have the 1.3 turbo'd I'll be turboing the 1.6 as it has soooo much more potential like 300bhp with little effort potential



i didnt know you could supply the lot for £500. It woul be nice to see, like Stani said, if you listed whats included with pictures extra, i think many would be interested. I know i would ;)
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
Can't the water pump be modified to rotate round out of the way? Or is the whole thing in the way?

its the pully, it sticks out the side of the engine, but its further back than all the other things on the belt, the chassis curves inwards towards the back which is where it hits. or rather its the bolts that hit on mine, the pully itself was clear. some counter sunk bolts, stiffer engine bushes, and a cut chassis may have solved the problem, but its better to get the engine away from the chassis leg. although having said that the further over you move the engine the bigger the difference in length is between the two drive shafts, and then you get toque steer, as one moves faster than the other.

but cutting big chunks out of your chassis to make room for a pump is the wrong thing to do, the chassis has an important job to do, not just holding the engine in but when the car crashes, so you want to leave that as intact as possible
 

ollyc98

Ex. Club Member
Oh right, nothing you can do really then. If you're gunna go to all the trouble of cutting mounts and chassis legs you may as well go for a rear engine conversion. Weld the front of the donor car into the back of the micra.
 
My GA16 sits further over to the right, with custom made driveshafts/mounts using the 1.3 gearbox. This has been in the car for over 3 years still alive and kicking fine. No chasis cutting etc and It will be turbo'd in the next couple of months. As far as 300bhp is concerned, if were talking stock internals then no, but a 180bhp-200bhp is do'able and safe to run with the right bits and management. Any questions feel free to ask ; )
 

micras69

Deactivated Account
off topic question, have you done any SR20 work? i am going to engine swap the cab, and i am still in two minds between the 1.6 and the 2.0, but the one thing i am not sure about is how you mesure the size for custom shafts? as the distance between the gearbox and wheels changes depending on if its on the ground or on jacks etc, how do you work out the right length?

anyway back on topic,

next, ive not done a full sr20 swap i just finished one off as im shure you know it takes a liitle more to fit one, i personaly would fit a GA16 over the sr20 for many reasons, more easy, less wireing, weight (as heavy engine up front in a small car handels ####!) and for me and what ive read and talked to other people about is that the GA16 is a stronger block for turboing

as for the shafts me and the fabricator mesured the 1.3 with the shafts on the ground and messured the play in she shaft and did the same wit the car up off the ground and found the middle of the 2 mesurements and the same with the 1.6 almera so we could see how much play was on each side of the shafts he then did some work on the calculator and made some cuts that were to long. he then put the shafts in each side and pushed them out and tacked the overlaps and marked up no shaft was to be wasted though. as soon as this was done it was off over to the the macheanist who drilled into one side of the shaft and removed some of the outher side then put some heftey threads on them in the directon the shaftes were going to be moving so they would always be tighternig if the weld some how faild then once they were screwed in the were welded up and tested to make shure they were balanced correctly
 

micras69

Deactivated Account
well how about you show us exactly what your offering for £500, detailed pics of the engine fitment, shafts etc...??? and if i were you #### the 1.3 turbo and continue the 1.6 if 300bhp is easily achievable

ive asked the owner and he doesnt want pics of his build on a forum just yet, dont know why but im not going to cheese him off. telling everyone and giving detaild info is just stoopid on my behalf realy isnt it? people can just copy and i'll not make any money.

as for #### the 1.3 and going on with the 1.6 is not my intentions at all, ive spent ££££ on parts for the 1.3 plus i like to do things in stages 1.3 then the 1.6 then the 2.0 if i jump starte in 1.6 i'll enjoy it get used to it and then want more so i would then move onto the 2.0 meaning i would do everything quicker and be done with the micras because there no more to do. so i'll just stick to the way i want to do it.
 

micras69

Deactivated Account
My GA16 sits further over to the right, with custom made driveshafts/mounts using the 1.3 gearbox. This has been in the car for over 3 years still alive and kicking fine. No chasis cutting etc and It will be turbo'd in the next couple of months. As far as 300bhp is concerned, if were talking stock internals then no, but a 180bhp-200bhp is do'able and safe to run with the right bits and management. Any questions feel free to ask ; )

im speeking to a guy in the usa who clames to making 287bhp from his almera 1.6 all he has changed internaly is the head gasket, head bolts and conrod bolts. its ran with the usual T25 from a 200sx and stand alone ect ect and aparantly this is quight common figures
 
Hey Micras69,

Dont dought hes not making that power as I've read and heard the same to. My only worries are how long it will last. is it 1.6 VTC version? then again you say hes changed conrods etc so this will make a difference. I talking everything completely stock, compression etc, but fair play if hes running that power ; )

hope to see yours sometime, get some pics up
 

frank

Club Member
they,ve got those (factory fitted) single ring annodised pistons over there tho (with huge ringlands) and they probably take about 3bar of boost, (far more than ukdm ones)
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hey Frank (Y), thats why I asked if its the VTC GA16 which is differnt to the UK one, i knew some things such as the inlet mani were different plus that it produces an extra 10-15BHP Compared to ours, but never knew the pistons were..Interesting to know

Cheers
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
arn't the GA16 blocks cast iron and there for more weight than the SR20?

is it the VVT GA16 that is the awesome one? and how exactly does that work? does it have a different ECU? main reason i ask is because i can get access to GA16 engines with 20k miles and VVT but no ECU or wiring.
 

frank

Club Member
arn't the GA16 blocks cast iron and there for more weight than the SR20?

is it the VVT GA16 that is the awesome one?

no thats the SR16ve aint it nex (n1 200hp ?)
and i think the GA is heavier than the SR but the SR g/box is very heavy tho :eek:
 

Glen

Club Member
i have worked out how to fit the 1.6 without cutting chassi legs and without getting shafts made. I will reveal more in the future about the fitting of the engine. Stani if you want to know more send me a pm and ill let u know.
 

NeX

You're after my robot bee
Club Member
no thats the SR16ve aint it nex (n1 200hp ?)
and i think the GA is heavier than the SR but the SR g/box is very heavy tho :eek:

really? maybe you are right i need to look into it more, i am probably confusing the SR16 with the GA16, i had a GA16 lying around i should have checked it.
 
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SuluR

SuluR

Buy & Sell Member
i have worked out how to fit the 1.6 without cutting chassi legs and without getting shafts made. I will reveal more in the future about the fitting of the engine. Stani if you want to know more send me a pm and ill let u know.

That sounds promising! would like to hear more about this :)

Thanks guys for all your help!
 

Glen

Club Member
DSC00902.jpg

IMG_0297-1.jpg


if you look at the pictures you can see the parts that need work. as the engine has been moved over 20 mm then people say you need drive shafts. well this is not true as frank covered ealier in the thread there is about 40mm of space to play with on each shaft means that the original 1.3 shafts fit without modification. You only need to make a front mount but its not necessary to do this. hope this helps a few people.
 

frank

Club Member
you will need to move the mount at the rear of the g/box over by 20mm too eh glen (that one takes all the torsional stresses, and the plastic front mount does SFA really)
 
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